bold coyotes?

Discussion of the training, use, and management of guard dogs, guard llamas, guard donkeys, guard goldfish, etc.
MattLynch
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bold coyotes?

Postby MattLynch » Sat Feb 01, 2014 12:15 pm

I am used to hearing and occasionally seeing coyotes where I live, and I am used to the dogs barking at them at night. We haven't lost any sheep to them yet. We are currently feeding our ewes inside but they can go outside to a 5 acre field fenced with 5 stards of ht wire, this is where the dogs spend most of their time but the sheep hardly go outside and stay close to the barn when they do.

Last night I heard the dogs barking at the barn end of the field and then one left and started barking at the far end of the field, didn't think much of it at the time. This morning I found tracks from what looked like 2 coyotes runing back and forth along the fence right beside the barn, my dogs tracks were right there on the other side of the fence. Judging by the amount of tracks I would say they were there for quite a while. At the far end of the field I found one set of coyote tracks walking up to the fence and then walking away, LGD tracks were heavy along the fence in that spot.

I don't know a lot about coyote behavior but it seems very stange that they would stay within 3m of barking LGD's, almost seems like they were trying to distract the dogs while another one could sneak around behind them? Still makes no sense to me because the sheep were in the barn.

Anyone have any experience with something like this or any idea what they were trying to accomplish? In no way would it have been an easy meal, and there are lots of other food sources for them now.
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Jon Carter
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby Jon Carter » Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:51 pm

Not at all uncommon for coyotes to game lgd's through the fence here. Especially pairs. They'll try to decoy the dogs off, ditch them then come back to make a kill. The more experienced pairs will have one draw the dogs off while the other flanks around. Our lgd's have had to learn how to deal with that tactic.

Jon
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http://jolefarms.blogspot.com/

MattLynch
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby MattLynch » Sun Feb 02, 2014 3:54 am

Thanks Jon, I just didn't think that they would try to pick a fight with my dogs. A little while ago I heard a fight at that area of the fence and found my dog covered in blood, his (a cut on his ear) and possibly a coyotes.

I have been very lucky so far but I'm starting to think with heavy coyote pressure and pasture lambing I am going to need more dog power sooner then I thought. My white dogs are great guards but maybe are more bark then bite.
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Darroll Grant
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby Darroll Grant » Sun Feb 02, 2014 8:48 am

Maybe you need a bit of yote population thinning. With that pressure now, pups in 3 months will not make it better.
Darroll Grant
western Oregon

MattLynch
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby MattLynch » Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:15 am

A few of my neighbours including the one right beside me have been trapping and shooting them for 10 plus years, and it seems to have had no effect on the population. I do worry that the origional coyotes that were here that didn't kill sheep have been killed and sheep killers have moved in.

If they start to get by my dogs I will start shooting, but I will reduce paddock size this year until I can ad another dog.
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Liz J
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby Liz J » Sun Feb 02, 2014 10:51 am

Another example of how the coyotes react to thinning - less population, more resources = more pups. While the LGD are wonderful, and if I had more space, I'd surely have one, are there any other things one could do to make life miserable for these critters so they move elsewhere?
Liz
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Darroll Grant
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby Darroll Grant » Sun Feb 02, 2014 3:20 pm

If the population is thinned about the time they breed, any improved reproductive response to better groceries would not occur for a year, but could save some sheep and LGD stress for this years lamb crop.
Darroll Grant

western Oregon

Darroll Grant
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby Darroll Grant » Sun Feb 02, 2014 3:23 pm

If the population is thinned about the time they breed, any improved reproductive response to better groceries would not occur for a year, but could save some sheep and LGD stress for this years lamb crop.
Darroll Grant

western Oregon

McMurry
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby McMurry » Sun Feb 02, 2014 5:51 pm

My thoughts are on not just on the number of them, but on the few very bold, well trained / experienced ones - the alpha pair who are leading their pack and not backing down in the face of your dogs. Unfortunately these are also the most difficult to do anything about as they have learned how to avoid all the threats that humans have been throwing at them. These individuals more than likely have you and your neighbors patterned - never letting you see them. The best option would be a team of very experienced adult lgds that have proven themselves, as a team, in this type of situation. I have heard that Anatolians are good in this type of situation.
Best of luck to you.

MattLynch
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby MattLynch » Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:38 am

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Bill Fosher
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby Bill Fosher » Fri Feb 07, 2014 7:11 am

Random thinning isn't going to do a thing, and in fact may make the problem worse for all the reasons others have described. You need to get the problem individuals. It's time for a real hunter who can study the animals and figure out which one or ones those are, and take them out.

lovetree
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby lovetree » Fri Feb 07, 2014 2:15 pm

If you were able to allow one of the dogs loose outside of the five acre pen, you will most likely solve the problem.
Mary Falk / LoveTree Farmstead
home of the dual purpose Trade Lake Sheep and the nationally celebrated Trade Lake Cedar Cheese
NW Wisconsin

lovetree
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby lovetree » Fri Feb 07, 2014 2:53 pm

also...it is currently coyote breeding season, when a bitch is in heat her serotonin levels are increased which alters her mood, making her (among other things) more curious..could be one of the things going on with the coyotes, but more likely they simply know that the dogs cant give chase and they are having a little fun.
Mary Falk / LoveTree Farmstead

home of the dual purpose Trade Lake Sheep and the nationally celebrated Trade Lake Cedar Cheese

NW Wisconsin

MattLynch
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby MattLynch » Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:03 am

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lambchop
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Re: bold coyotes?

Postby lambchop » Sat Feb 08, 2014 8:22 am

Matt,
Getting more aggressive dogs could have a down side. First, if you have neighbors that might not want your dogs chasing through their places, chasing onto a busy rd, and getting hit, and attitude toward people. We run 8-9 dogs, and want them to stay home. we have yotes all around us, listen to them at night, and on occasion see them crossing a pasture. The dogs keep them out of the sheep, and we don't have kills. Thats all I look at as far as whether the dogs are doing their job, don't care how many or where the coyotes might be.
Paul Lewis
White Dorpers with Lambplan EBV's
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